Does anyone know how the 991.2/992 Carrera rods compare to the stout stock 911 turbo rods?

Originally Posted by Blown6

Does anyone know how the 991.2/992 Carrera rods compare to the stout stock 911 turbo rods?

Wish I had the answer to this.

I've always wondered why there aren't any really high hp (2000hwhp+) 911 turbo considering its the same level of performance if not greater than a GT-R.

Originally Posted by Solid67

I've always wondered why there aren't any really high hp (2000hwhp+) 911 turbo considering its the same level of performance if not greater than a GT-R.

There's a point where it's no longer a 911.

Those 2000+ awhp GTR's are powerful and fast in a straight line but you need billet blocks and built transmisions and who knows how long they last.

9FF has some 2000+ hp 911's.

I'll probably do an article on this one:

Originally Posted by Sticky

There's a point where it's no longer a 911.

Those 2000+ awhp GTR's are powerful and fast in a straight line but you need billet blocks and built transmisions and who knows how long they last.

9FF has some 2000+ hp 911's.

I'll probably do an article on this one:

Hey thanks for posting this!! Is this rwd or awd? Does 9FF have a 991.1 model with this kit?

Originally Posted by Solid67

Hey thanks for posting this!! Is this rwd or awd? Does 9FF have a 991.1 model with this kit?

I'm not sure. These European tuners are hard to get info from.

Originally Posted by Solid67

I've always wondered why there aren't any really high hp (2000hwhp+) 911 turbo considering its the same level of performance if not greater than a GT-R.

The GTR was built to beat the 911 Turbo in 2008, according to the magazines and many car enthusiasts it succeeded pushing the envelope and causing many supercar manufacturers to go back to the drawing board, ever since then the aftermarket took the GTR to levels previously dreamed of in a street car. These high hp street GTRs , once termed unbeatable , have caused aftermarket to become more competitive with TT Lambos etc making big power. 911s are playing catch-up but have been very active as of late with formidable kits for sale.

Originally Posted by Solid67

I've always wondered why there aren't any really high hp (2000hwhp+) 911 turbo considering its the same level of performance if not greater than a GT-R.

$$$, to get a Porsche to that power level would require a build with a lot of costly custom fabrication unlike the gtr market which has kits available for almost every performance level. The last major porsche build i can remember was a 997 making 1800whp by EvoMS and the owner then got a gallardo superleggera built by nth moto which made him change his mind about keeping what at the time was the fastest porsche in the half mile and most powerful too.

I hear everyone on the $$$$ part. I just figured since the GTR and 911 Turbo are literally the same in being 3.8TT/awd/dual cluth, its just interesting to see that at Texas2K its always GTR vs Lambo TT, so that's where my curiosity came from like why aren't there any very high hp 911 turbo. Now I know that there are actual high hp 911 turbo and seems like they are starting to come for the GTR and Lambo TT.

Originally Posted by Solid67

I hear everyone on the $$$$ part. I just figured since the GTR and 911 Turbo are literally the same in being 3.8TT/awd/dual cluth, its just interesting to see that at Texas2K its always GTR vs Lambo TT, so that's where my curiosity came from like why aren't there any very high hp 911 turbo. Now I know that there are actual high hp 911 turbo and seems like they are starting to come for the GTR and Lambo TT.

It's cause the cost of the cars.

991.1/2 TT/S used are still 110-160k, to get 1200whp like this is needs about 60-80k in mods. Total cost is high.
GTR used is like 50k, to get to 1200whp, it's about 40k. Total cost for same power is about 100k less.
For the price of the built 991.1/2 you can get a Huracan and put 40k TT kit and do about the same.

Originally Posted by Payam@BMS

It's cause the cost of the cars.

991.1/2 TT/S used are still 110-160k, to get 1200whp like this is needs about 60-80k in mods. Total cost is high.
GTR used is like 50k, to get to 1200whp, it's about 40k. Total cost for same power is about 100k less.
For the price of the built 991.1/2 you can get a Huracan and put 40k TT kit and do about the same.

A 2009 GTR is ~50k in the used market as is a 2009 911 Turbo.

Originally Posted by Solid67

I've always wondered why there aren't any really high hp (2000hwhp+) 911 turbo considering its the same level of performance if not greater than a GT-R.

Huge difference in the aftermarket between them and also the competition. Prime example new supra, probably 10-15 real shops shooting to be 1st, the development that has taken place in the last 3 months would have taken 3 years if it wasnt for the competition. Nothing fuels the fire more than wanting to be 1st and not being 1st. Or nothing like getting gapped that makes you go home and buy more mods.

So with the GTR vs the porsche. Theres so many legit players in the GTR world and so much competiton which leads to money spent which leads to development. And its driven by data, a lot more educated consumers, while most of the porsche world is allergic to data. The price point also doesn't help, but the 991s are getting cheaper and finally more real players are entering the market.

Originally Posted by Sticky

There's a point where it's no longer a 911.

Those 2000+ awhp GTR's are powerful and fast in a straight line but you need billet blocks and built transmisions and who knows how long they last.

9FF has some 2000+ hp 911's.

I'll probably do an article on this one:

They probably dynoed it next to the C8 with motor trend on the same magical dyno where 991s make 800wheel but only trap 140. In general I feel like anyone who gloats about crank numbers in 2019 = marketing BS. I know of one other car that has gone the same 215 multiple times , 997, mezger, sequential trans, and it takes around 1400whp to do so and those passes were with shifting issues.

Originally Posted by Solid67

I hear everyone on the $$$$ part. I just figured since the GTR and 911 Turbo are literally the same in being 3.8TT/awd/dual cluth, its just interesting to see that at Texas2K its always GTR vs Lambo TT, so that's where my curiosity came from like why aren't there any very high hp 911 turbo. Now I know that there are actual high hp 911 turbo and seems like they are starting to come for the GTR and Lambo TT.

They are the same but different. One sits upright and the block is one piece, for example the mezger is many pieces bolted together and it sits on the side. Just that simple difference alone makes a big difference when pushing high horsepower. With the newer 991 motors, the block itself is sturdier as theres physically less pieces. The two real players pushing the 991 platform are aim/es motors and topspeed. Both have gone 202 in the 1/2, and it takes right around 1150whp-1200whp to do 200 in the 1/2 in a 991.

Originally Posted by Payam@BMS

It's cause the cost of the cars.

991.1/2 TT/S used are still 110-160k, to get 1200whp like this is needs about 60-80k in mods. Total cost is high.
GTR used is like 50k, to get to 1200whp, it's about 40k. Total cost for same power is about 100k less.
For the price of the built 991.1/2 you can get a Huracan and put 40k TT kit and do about the same.

Yup, right on the money. The cheaper the 991's get, the faster the platform will be.

Originally Posted by Blown6

A 2009 GTR is ~50k in the used market as is a 2009 911 Turbo.

50k barely gets you a 2007 tiptronic 997. Any half decent manual car is 60k minimum. And they made a lot less 997's than gtr's so cheaper to get into and cheaper to mod. 100k-ish can now buy you a legit 1200whp GTR.

^^ He beat me to the explanation.

Originally Posted by arkadyzv

Yup, right on the money. The cheaper the 991's get, the faster the platform will be.



50k barely gets you a 2007 tiptronic 997. Any half decent manual car is 60k minimum. And they made a lot less 997's than gtr's so cheaper to get into and cheaper to mod. 100k-ish can now buy you a legit 1200whp GTR.

Actually, they made twice as many 2007 997 turbos than 2009 GTRs. The GTR is still the most expensive japanese platform to modify by far and they keep their values, just look at the 2009 you referenced which was 70k in 2009 and is still 50k 10yrs later. You can easily spend over 10k just on an exhaust so don’t kid yourself.

No, the GTR has a huge japanese history as a tuner car going back to the 90s and was much anticipated in the USA, when it finally hit in 2008-2009 it took off as THE tuner car and still today is the street/strip car to beat. 911s have been around in the USA forever and there was huge talks about how the more affordable 997.1 TT with metzger engine would be an aftermarket contender but it never happened even to this day. In my area you can pickup a 2007-2008 turbo for the same price as a 2009 gtr.

5 speed Mercedes made Tiptronic 911 turbos were sold in the US until 2009 and are still demanding $60k, PDK didn’t kick off fully until 2010 in the USA. It’s Porsche branding that’s demanding the pricing with so many people desperate to be part of the club. I don’t need to tell people here to check out the prices of older Porsches, it’s the branding, far and away superior to Nissan or even Lambo.

We shouldn’t even be talking about the slow shifting tiptronic on the dragstrip or airstrip.

The r35 gtr is easiest to make huge power and low ETs reliably and consistently, sure a manual or sequential civic can be made to run 8s but you need one hell of a driver mod, excellent prep, etc. to do that consistently.

in my opinion the guys with money skipped over the 911 turbo for the lambo to beat the gtr, bigger displacement. Why choose 3.8 to build on when you can choose 5.0? Turbo and Huracan are similar weight both awd and both dual clutch. If money wasn’t an option we’d all have 7 sec twin turbo Huracans,

Originally Posted by Blown6

Actually, they made twice as many 2007 997 turbos than 2009 GTRs. The GTR is still the most expensive japanese platform to modify by far and they keep their values, just look at the 2009 you referenced which was 70k in 2009 and is still 50k 10yrs later. You can easily spend over 10k just on an exhaust so don’t kid yourself.

Im not talking theories or generalizations I'm talking reality. A nice 997 turbo is still more money to buy and more money to mod than any year GTR. Thats a fact not an opinion. The manual ones are more money, the auto's are slushbox's. The PDK didnt come till 2010 in the 997.2. So to get a 911 in equal condition with an equal transmission is 70k. Kidding is saying that someone is buying a 10k exhaust for a GTR, a built short block with no core is cheaper for that car.

After I sold my 15TTS, I thought about buying a built 1200whp GTR, most figured out one's were in the 100k -ish range. For that level of performance in a street car nothing else comes close. I know that exists because the car I was considering was bought by someone else local and it ran like it made the 1200whp that it was advertised as making.

Originally Posted by Blown6

No, the GTR has a huge japanese history as a tuner car going back to the 90s and was much anticipated in the USA, when it finally hit in 2008-2009 it took off as THE tuner car and still today is the street/strip car to beat. 911s have been around in the USA forever and there was huge talks about how the more affordable 997.1 TT with metzger engine would be an aftermarket contender but it never happened even to this day. In my area you can pickup a 2007-2008 turbo for the same price as a 2009 gtr.

You must not live in the US then, I just looked on cars.com decent 09 GTR with reasonable miles 40k was 55,000. Cheapest 997 turbo slushbox 80k mile dumpster is 55,000 . You get more car for the money with the GTR and from a modding standpoint you will get way more for your money because the aftermarket is huge. While the price point maybe be comparable the rest is not, GTR wins all. The 2007 997 turbo base price was 120k it has never been an aftermarket contender nor will ever be.

With the 911, the cars cost more, the parts cost more, maintenance costs more and is more labor intensive. The biggest pro to the porsche is that it lighter and more efficient and the stock PDK takes an insane amount of abuse.

Originally Posted by Bowser330

5 speed Mercedes made Tiptronic 911 turbos were sold in the US until 2009 and are still demanding $60k, PDK didn’t kick off fully until 2010 in the USA. It’s Porsche branding that’s demanding the pricing with so many people desperate to be part of the club. I don’t need to tell people here to check out the prices of older Porsches, it’s the branding, far and away superior to Nissan or even Lambo.

We shouldn’t even be talking about the slow shifting tiptronic on the dragstrip or airstrip.

Theres actually some development going on right now with the tiptronics. Aim perfomance has a customer with a 997 turbo vert tiptronic, went 197 in the 1/2 mile with a built tip. The problem is that it leaves like $#@! because the turbos are too lazy and you can't stall it high enough with the tip. Since the guts are the same as the NAG1 chrysler trans that you mentioned, they had paramount build the trans in it. Last weekend it went 9.1 @ 143 letting off before the quarter just stalling it up. Theres also spray on it to actually make it spool the gt35s. Needless to say once all the kinks are worked out it will be going high 8's really soon as it usually traps 160s.

Originally Posted by Bowser330

The r35 gtr is easiest to make huge power and low ETs reliably and consistently, sure a manual or sequential civic can be made to run 8s but you need one hell of a driver mod, excellent prep, etc. to do that consistently.

in my opinion the guys with money skipped over the 911 turbo for the lambo to beat the gtr, bigger displacement. Why choose 3.8 to build on when you can choose 5.0? Turbo and Huracan are similar weight both awd and both dual clutch. If money wasn’t an option we’d all have 7 sec twin turbo Huracans,

Aint that the truth, in the mean time everyone with a schmedium fast GTR is looking at the 991 prices get lower and lower so they can get similar performance but in a nicer car.

Great point on the displacement and more so cylinder count. And thats the main point that people forget. A 2000whp lambo has 10 holes and is making 200whp a hole. A 2000whp gtr has 6 holes and is making 333whp a hole. Which ones gonna make more passes lol?

I wasn’t aware of that development on the tiptronic transmissions, very cool. 997.1’s are at a great price....Paramount advertises to build badass transmissions! The two most significant things to me about the dct is the launch and the quick shifts, so for me, it’s worth waiting for since it would have to be daily-able.
For a fun car that that tiptronic would be a great value.